This is part of the Destiny of Velious expansion. As with all other writeups for the new expansion, information was mainly gathered during the beta testing phase, and I have been gathering updated information now that the content is available on the Live servers. Note that this expansion contains content for level 85+ crafters. If you are below this crafting level, you will not be able to do this quest.
Welcome to the first-ever tradeskill heritage quest for EverQuest2! (Heritage quest in EQ2 means a reallllly long quest with many, many steps, to earn or re-create some historic item from the original EQ lore.) Completion of this quest will reward the dedicated crafter with the Blessed Coldain Prayer Shawl, among other things. (For a trip down memory lane, you can check out "the original EQ quest for the shawl here.
House item version
|Personal Notes of
You must first complete the Eirik-Alfrig-Tora crafting quest series in Thurgadin. At the end of the "Inside the Vision" quest with Tora, she will give you the starter for "What Dreams May Come".
There is lots of lovely dialog in Inside the Vision to explain why there are so many coldain ghosts around, why they hope to get Brell's blessing to free them, etc., and I am going to assume, if you get this far, that you are either familiar with it, or are headed out "real soon now" to do those quests and get started.
Off you go, in search of more information, to see if the shawl still exists. Your first stop will be with Fenwick, the gnomish pirate on the Thurgadin docks (since there were gnomish pirates at the scene when Brell appeared to bless the original prayer shawl).
Fenwick can give you a bit more background, but very little extra detail, however, so he sends you off to rummage through the writings of the Coldain in search of more information.
Head into Thurgadin, and to the Temple of Brell. Once there, go to the far wall (where the shelves are) and find scrolls on the second shelf from the bottom at 475, -211, 237. If you are a tailor or an armorer, you will find that both scrolls are clickable, all others will only be able to click on one. Click on the scroll to receive Personal Notes of Lorekeeper Solstrin for the quest update, which is also a house item. (Tailors and Armorers, click on both scrolls, so you can make some of the traditional gear from the era of the prayer shawl - it may not be suitable for protection, but it looks very lovely! You can find images of the clothing at the bottom of this link.)
Verdandi ... and a Delay
At this point, you need to speak with a coldain loremaster for more information. However, the nearby (473, -211, 255) Loremaster Verdandi won't speak with just anyone, and you are going to have to do some faction work.
You will need 40,000 faction with the Forgemasters of Thurgadin before she will speak with you further to progress the quest. This means some more questing (if you haven't already done Aggi's questline), as well as the daily Forgemaster faction quest from Mikk, as listed on the bottom of this page.
While You Are Waiting on Faction
There is a "shopping list" at the bottom of the page with the items that you will need to harvest, buy or otherwise acquire during this quest - you may want to check that out while you are still working on the faction, so that you have things like the fresh clay ready when you are to the step needing class-specific combines.
Yes, one step will require fresh clay, a ground spawn for the Tupta daily crafting quest. While you are waiting for the Thurgadin daily to reset, it might be a good time to grab enough clay for 1 per alt that will be doing the shawl quest. Now, the catch is that if you have a carpenter in your alt-army that will be doing this quest, you should have them grab the clay. The clay is no-trade, and is needed for a carpenter combine for the shawl. (The combine itself is heirloom, so you can have your carpenter make the bit for the others on your account.) If you don't have a carpenter working on the quest, grab the clay on whichever alt is going to be working on the quest first. You will find that the clay is spawned during most of the Tupta dailies, but not all of them, so don't count on it being available at the last minute, and plan ahead. (There is at least 1 Tupta daily with no crafting involved, and I have not seen the clay spawn when working on that specific daily.)
Verdandi After Faction
Once you have obtained 40,000 faction with the Forgemasters of Thurgadin, Verdandi will speak with you in more detail. When you ask her about the notes that you found, she's happy to tell you a bit more (she also explains about the recipes that tailors and armorers can obtain when they were picking up the notes, so you have the lore reason of "why" those two classes got some extra appearance recipes).
Loremaster Verdandi says to you, "Ah, yes. He was a remarkable artisan himself, specializing in armorsmithing. I believe we still have some of his recipes in the library; in fact, I'm wearing a robe based on his notes. We can make stronger, lighter armor nowdays, but it pleases me to keep the old traditions."
Sadly, when you steer the conversation to Loremaster Boranin and the prayer shawl, she talks about the fine craftsmanship of the shawl just before she tells you that the shawl's owner, and the shawl itself, haven't been seen for at least two centuries.
Loremaster Verdandi says to you, "Aye. Some claim that the kromrif killed its owner and took it for themselves. Others said the mighty griffin Stormfeather himself ripped it from the shoulders of its wearer as he avenged the deaths of his pride. Still more claim it returned to the traveler's home continent and is there still. Alas, it has been lost for two centuries at least."
In addition, so many of the records have been lost since the Cataclysm, that she doesn't hold out hope of being able to re-make it from scratch, much less of getting it blessed once it was made.
A bit discouraged, you leave, promising to at least try to narrow down what happened to the original shawl. Since griffins were mentioned, perhaps I could find an expert on the griffins of Velious to consult?
Who else would you go to about griffins but your new friend Capru in the Goahmari Village? After all, you've already proven yourself to him, so he should be willing to speak with you.
You find Capru already waiting for you, thanks to a vision that he had. You're not so sure about this vision stuff, but you plow along with your question in a sort of sideways way, mentioning the great hero who wore the prayer shawl.
Capru says to you, "Unfortunately, the griffins of the past, and now their gryphon descendants, have long been targets for those who wish to prove their might in combat. I do not know what happened to this person you mentioned. But that is not the question you really want answered."
You say to Capru, "It isn't? I'm fairly sure it is."
Capru says to you, "No, the question you really want answered is, what became of the shawl? And that I can answer. Long ago, the mighty griffin Stormfeather fell to earth in our village, severely wounded. Respecting all life as we do, we protected him and healed his wounds. Clutched in his claw was a bloodied, shredded shawl."
A bit more conversation, and you find out that it was of exceptionally fine workmanship, so the goahmari, after cleaning and studying it, put it carefully away. They then forgot about it until Capru's vision of the night before.
You ask if you can take it, since it is very important to the coldain.
Capru says to you, "The shawl is in that box at my feet, ____. It is yours now. You will also find the notes that our artisans first made when trying to decide how to repair the shawl; perhaps they will be of some use to you."
Grab the shawl from the chest beside his feet. (Don't be like me in beta, twice, and run off to the nearest loom, then realize you have to run allll the way back, grab the shawl, run back to the loom, etc.) You will receive: Damaged Coldain Prayer Shawl and Goahmari Notes on Shawl Repair.
Head to a sewing table and try to repair the worst of the damage. You will also need one crystalline spiderling silk** and an ethereal filament. End result is "silk coldain prayer shawl".
**If, for some reason, you decided to skip the crafter version of the flying mount quest, and don't want to run through the first several of Capru's quests, you will likely find the silk on the broker.
Back to the Coldain
So, you now have a silk coldain prayer shawl. There is, however more that needs to be done to repair it, so it is time to go back to Verdandi with your progress, and see what she says.
She's very amazed and awed, as she never expected to see such a precious artifact. When she finds out that you are going to try to repair it, she gives you the proverbial good news/bad news. She remembers that it was mentioned that the embroidery on it was so fine that it used the hair of a siren from Cobalt Scar, an area lost to them since the Cataclysm cut them off from the rest of the continent -- if it still exists at all!
You get what details you can from her regarding the embroidery (recipe scroll: Coldain Records on Historical Embroidery, and head off to see what you can do about siren hair...
Perhaps the othmir, who fled from that area, might know what happened to the sirens of Cobalt Scar? With that thought in mind, you seek out Mira in Fina's Retreat.
Mira tells you a bit about their departure from that area, then a bit about the sirens, saying that she doesn't know what happened to them, but that they would have been in quite a bit of danger from the upheaval.
As with Capru, you seem to be asking about things in a roundabout way, and the being you are talking to is taking a more direct route.
Mira says to you, "Why do you want to talk to a siren? They were not the friendliest of people, as I heard it."
When you explain that it is actually their hair that you are looking for, for some embroidery, Mira is able to help.
Mira says to you, "I may be able to help. Siren hairs were what the sirens gave us in trade, and they are greatly valued. Since we cannot get more, we use them very rarely now, but I have some passed down to me by my grandparent. I can spare you two, but two only, in thanks for all your help earlier."
(I sincerely hope that you have helped her by now. If not, what are you waiting for? :D)
She will give you two siren hair. One you will need immediately, the other you will need to save for a later combine. If you lose the siren hair, you will need to visit the Shady Swashbuckler on the Nektulos Forest docks for another, and he's likely to charge you quite a bit, so don't lose it, k?
Head back to a sewing table, scribe the scroll that Verdandi gave you and get to work on the Embroidered Coldain Prayer Shawl recipe. You will need the silk coldain prayer shawl, 1 siren hair, and 1 ethereal filament. Once you are done, return to Verdandi once again and see what else needs to be done.
Loremaster Verdandi says to you, "Oh, ____! This is outstanding craftsmanship indeed. I have never seen finer work, your repairs are almost indistinguishable from the original. Truly, if anyone can restore this prayer shawl it surely must be you."
That having been said, she says that what seems to be missing is a very intricate sacred rune that was sewn into it, and the casting of it had been an intricate, multi-step process.
You say to Loremaster Verdandi, "Casting a sacred rune? You mean, like casting a spell?"
Loremaster Verdandi says to you, "Sort of, but this rune was literally cast in a mold, from an enchanted metal alloy. It's a physical representation of a spell, if you like: the rune represented the very essence of our people, our culture, and our religion. Even before the knowledge was lost, it was very rare and difficult for an artisan to be able to create."
Unfortunately, the knowledge on how to proceed has been lost.
Verdandi asks you to consider leaving the shawl in Thurgadin for their historians to study, saying that most would spend their whole lives praying to Brell for such an opportunity. You, however, want to study it more, and feel that they should, rather, pray for your success in restoring it further.
Loremaster Verdandi says to you, "Prayer to Brell is never a bad idea, _____, particularly when undertaking a work of great craftsmanship of great significance to Brell. We have a temple in Thurgadin, should you wish to use it. Either way, good luck."
Praying for Aid
Perhaps a prayer wouldn't hurt! If you are also a tinkerer and have done all the Iceclad Ocean crafting quests, you already know of one method to pray to Brell -- gnomish pirate spirits left on Brell's altar! If you aren't a high enough level tinker to have done Fenwick's tinkering quests, never fear. The spirits are fully tradeable, and you should be able to find a fellow crafter to buy them from.
Bring the spirits to the Temple of Brell in Thurgadin, place them on the low altar at the far end of the temple, then move more into the middle of the temple and meditate. This means stand still and wait. Really. Stand still and wait for it. None of that annoying bouncing around like a demented Mexican jumping bean that some of you do when you're impatient. Calm. Wait for inspiration. Trust me, you'll know when inspiration hits, in the form of a bright beam of light transfixing you, then a voice speaking into your mind. :D
Return to the altar once you have been inspired, and you will find that something has been left for you - a scroll containing your class-specific recipe for your part in repairing and placing the rune, as well as the recipe for the Runed Coldain Prayer Shawl.
Class Specific Combines
All items from these combines are heirloom and can be commissioned. In some cases, you need a piece from one crafter in order to get the piece from another crafter, so please read carefully. I have noted the spots where you (the customer) must provide a no-trade or heirloom piece for the crafter performing the commission combine, but, obviously, you should be providing all the ingredients if you are getting pieces made from a fellow crafter, unless you've made other arrangements in advance. (Translation: please don't expect them to have all the extra fish, fuel, manticore manes etc on hand for you.)
A Word About Alt-Armies
If you are working on updates for several alts at once: Each character must get every single update, in the order listed below, so if you are getting updates made for several at once, do not combine the intermediate combines into their final forms until you have logged in all the alts needing their update.. For example, if you have 4 folks on the same account needing updates, you will not want to turn all 4 rune casting molds into blank brellium runes until all 4 alts gotten their update. If you are storing the bits in the shared bank so they can get their updates, sometimes you will need to pick an update item out of the shared bank, and put it in their bags before they will get their updates.
If you're easily confused, ignore this paragraph, and do what works for you best. If you're the organized sort, however, you can work around the update requirement so that you don't have to log all of them in quite as much. For example, I was working on all 9 crafters for updates at once(!!!), so I: made 10 rune casting molds since I had extra clay, and it was an easy one to do. I then converted 9 of the rune casting molds into blank brellium runes (leaving 1 mold still in the bank for everyone's update), then I made 9 burin, I then turned 8 of the burin and the rune casting molds into etched brellium runes (leaving 1 burin and 1 rune casting mold in the bank for everyone's update), then I got the liquid velium and the cutlassfish oil combined times 9. I then turned 8 of the cutlassfish oil and liquid velium into sacred velium ink (leaving 1 each behind), made 9 of sacred coldain thread, and then crafted 7 of the velium etched runes. Then I logged everyone in, one by one, picking up a piece here and there to force it to recognize all those bits and pieces in the shared bank. Once everyone was done with allll those updates, and ready to sew it all onto the shawl, I then went back and turned the last rune casting mold into the blank brellium rune, combined the stray runes, etc., etc into their final bits. It took extra organization, it took dragging various classes back out to do more combines instead of doing them all at once, but it prevented me from having to make 1 update, log everyone in, make another update, log everyone in, etc. How you work with multiple alts is your own business, of course, I'm just trying to show you how to plan ahead so someone doesn't miss an early update that requires you to go back and make several somethings over again at the last minute. :D
Back to those Class-Specific Combines
You will need to get the following quest updates in the following order:
- Carpenter: Rune casting mold. Need no-trade fresh clay from Tupta daily mission), 2 sumac lumber, 1 titanium ore, 5 ethereal sandpaper. Customer needs to provide the clay in order to commision.
- Armorer: Blank Brellium Rune. Need brellium ore, rune casting mold (carpenter), ethereal material, ethereal coal. Customer needs to provide rune casting mold in order to commission.
- Weaponsmith: Burin. Need Molkor hide, Iceclad Swordfish, 1 titanium ore, 5 ethereal coal
- Woodworker: Etched Brellium Rune. Needs Blank Brellium Rune (armorer), Burin (Weaponsmith), 5 ethereal sandpaper. Customer needs to provide both rune and burin for the commission.
- Alchemist: Liquid velium. Needs Geniune velium powder (souvenir merchant Hagus), gnomish pirate spirits (tinkerer), ethereal candle.
- Provisioner: Cutlassfish oil. Need 3 Iceclad Cutlassfish. You will also need 1 aerated mineral water and 5 ethereal kindling.
- Sage: Liquid Velium Ink. Needs Liquid Velium (alchemist), Cutlassfish oil (provisioner), 5 ethereal incense. Customer needs to provide both ink and oil for the commission.
- Tailor: Sacred Coldain Thread. Needs Woven Frost Giant Beard (Souvenir Merchant Hagus), 1 Siren Hair, 2 Manticore Manes, 5 ethereal filament. Customer needs to provide the siren hair for the commission.
- Jeweler: Velium Etched Rune. Need Etched Brellium Rune (woodworker), Liquid Velium Ink (sage), 1** ethereal coal. Customer needs to provide both rune and ink for the commission. (Currently only requires 1 fuel where most of the rest of the class combines need 5. It is assumed this is a bug)
Once you have gone through all that multi-class song and dance, you should be ready to create the Runed Coldain Prayer Shawl with the final bits and pieces. You will need the Sacred Coldain Thread from the tailor, and the Velium Etched Rune from the Jeweler, along with an ethereal filament.
Once done, of course, it still needs to tested to see if it will truly help those trapped coldain ghosts...
Testing Your Skill and Speed
For many of you, you're used to zipping right through most crafting combines these days. However, you may have noticed that the combine for the Runed Coldain Prayer Shawl took a bit longer than most level 90 combines, if you didn't dig out your crafting gear and put it on.
If you don't already have any +progress, +success and so on crafting gear on, you may want to dig it out, acquire a cranial capacitor and a tinkered success booster and the like. You are about to embark on five timed combines that will test your skill and alertness -- and that will kill you if you miss an event counter. As long as you're paying attention, you should have no problem completing the combines in the 12 minutes allotted. Go now, get your drink, take a bio and stretch break, tell your guildmates that you are going to be ignoring them for a while, and then come back, ready to focus your attention on the task at hand.
With the Runed Coldain Prayer Shawl in-hand, return to Tora out at the old Ringwar Battlefield.
Tora says to you, "Brell's blessings, _____. What brings you back here?"
You say to Tora, "Do you remember our discussion about the prayer shawl that was blessed by Brell, and whether the residual blessing might be enough to free the spirits?"
Tora says to you, "I remember. But ____, I told you, that prayer shawl is long lost. Even if it can be found, it's very old now and may have no remaining power."
You say to Tora, "I remember you said it was long lost. But I have a surprise for you. Look at this!"
Tora says to you, "What ... how? ____, is that the blessed prayer shawl? It can't be, it looks in such good condition for its age. What is this?"
Well, bowl her over with a feather, why don't you? Explain how you repaired it, and she gives it a more thorough inspection before giving it her seal of approval. She isn't sure that it has enough blessing left in it to free all the remaining spirits, but she is willing to give it a try if you are.
Tora says to you, "We'll need to perform another ritual to summon the spirits to the shawl, then we can try to use it to free them. There's a quiet cave under the ring war battlefield we can use - it's a difficult passage, so I'll summon a teleportation orb to transport us directly there."
Click the orb that appears beside her to be ported into a special instance. Hail her again and she will have you place the shawl on the small altar. Before you talk to her further, click all 4 clickables on the altar to receive 20 of each of the needed ingredients and fuel. (Hmmmm ... dwarven beard clippings ... oh, Brasse? ;D)
Start to talk to her again, but read her text carefully so as not to start the timer too soon...
Tora says to you, "We're on a time limit here. If the spirits' war restarts while we're working, they will be drawn back to it, so we need to work fast. I will chant the summoning ritual, while you craft some summoning crystals and place them on the shawl to draw the spirits here."
You say to Tora, "How do I make those?"
"Here's a recipe, and I've left supplies of all the ingredients you will need on the rock by the shawl. Use the fire to infuse the herbs and my spells into the crystals. Take a moment now to prepare yourself."
Stop talking to her. Do not tell her you are ready.
Make sure you have the ingredients, scribe the scroll that she gives you, place yourself between the fire and the altar (so that the altar can be clicked without having to move), take a few deep breaths and prepare yourself.
Ok, ready, set, go ...
You say to Tora, "All right ... I'm ready to begin now."
Click on the firepit and start crafting. Remember, missed counters WILL kill you, but if you catch the miss fast enough, you can cancel the combine before the failure registers. This will save you some precious time lost while you revive, etc.
Craft five of the orbs, clicking on the shawl on the altar after each combine to place the orb. (You can only start to place them when not crafting, so click the altar the moment you finish one, and while it is placing, get the next combine started.) If you forget to place one after making it, continue with the current combine, click the altar to place the missed one, click the altar to place the second one, then click to start the recipe while the second one is placing.
What if You Fail?
If the timer runs out before you are done, you will need to start over. Stretch, breathe, make sure you still have enough ingredients left, hail Tora again, and you're off and crafting again.
A Surprise Visit
The last crystal is placed and drained of power. Suddenly a large figure appears.
Brell Serilis says to you, "What calls me here? I cannot leave the council at present."
You say to Brell Serilis, "Er ... lord Brell, it may have been this artifact that called to you. You once bestowed your blessing upon its fine craftsmanship; I have been repairing it."
Brell Serilis says to you, "A fine accomplishment indeed for a mortal. But why should I not destroy you for disturbing the spirits of my creations like this?"
You say to Brell Serilis, "Because I am trying to help them! The spirits of these coldain have been trapped in this realm since the end of the great Ring War some two hundred years ago. We hoped to use the residue of your blessing to set them free."
Brell Serilis says to you, "Thank you for your good intent, small mortal, but these poor brave warriors appear to be serving a valuable task for their people. Did you not see the ghostly kromzek pressing the attack? Zek has inspired their aggression, and without these brave spirits to continue the defense, Thurgadin would struggle to defend itself."
You say to Brell Serilis, "You mean they need to stay? But they have already been trapped for so long..."
Brell Serilis says to you, "A mere instant, in the grand scheme of things. What means time to a fierce warrior of Brell? Once the situation with Rallos Zek is resolved, I shall return for them, and escort them myself into my Halls."
You say to Brell Serilis, "Then the coldain are not to blame for them remaining here? Their deaths did not displease you?"
Brell Serilis says to you, "Enough, small mortal. Those in Thurgadin have not displeased me, but I have not time to test your comprehension with more details. You have done well indeed to create that prayer shawl which called me here, and I am pleased to bless it once again, but I cannot be here right now. "
You say to Brell Serilis, "Farewell, lord Brell, and thank you."
Erm. Whoops! All that unnecessary dwarven guilt for all those long, long years. At least they will finally know, now, and can fret about something else ... like the issue with Rallos Zek.
Your task is almost done. You don't need to talk to Tora, as she was right beside you and heard what he said. However, Loremaster Verdandi should be told.
Off you go back to Thurgadin with the blessed shawl, to speak with Verdandi.
Loremaster Verdandi says to you, "_____, is that ... the prayer shawl?"
You say to Loremaster Verdandi, "Yes it is, what do you think?"
Loremaster Verdandi says to you, "I think I'm privileged to see such a thing in my lifetime. But it looks quite insubstantial, almost not of this world. How...?"
You say to Loremaster Verdandi, "Once the rune was complete and the shawl was restored as much as possible, I used the remnants of Brell's blessing to free some of the coldain spirits trapped in the Ring War area. They were able to pass on to the Halls of the Creator."
Loremaster Verdandi says to you, "But why the glow?"
You say to Loremaster Verdandi, "It seems my actions pleased Brell. He blessed the shawl once again, and thanked me for bringing his attention to the trapped warriors. However, he said the remaining spirits will need to remain a bit longer to continue to fight the spirits of the giants that Rallos Zek is sending."
Loremaster Verdandi says to you, "Can it be true? Brell has not forgotten our trapped ancestors, and will return for them once it is time? And their neverending battle is the doing of Rallos Zek, not the fault of the coldain who chose to defend Thurgadin so long ago? I .... I ... excuse me, I have something in my eye."
You say to Loremaster Verdandi, "It's all true. The coldain spirits are performing a very real defense of Thurgadin right now, and Brell has blessed them also, and has not abandoned them. Your people can stop feeling guilty for those actions so long ago."
You are rewarded with tradeskill experience (if all this questing hasn't already dinged you to level 90 in your crafting profession, however, I'd be surprised), achievement experience, 83200 guild status, 5000 Forgemasters of Thurgadin faction and 5000 City of Thurgadin faction. (Yes, you get some adventurer city faction - after all, you did a huge service not just for the crafters, but all coldain, by not only restoring such a historic artifact, but passing along Brell's message.) And, of course, you also get the Blessed Coldain Prayer Shawl.
You can also inspect the shawl to turn it into a house item if you want, and then go buy another from the Shady Swashbuckler on the Nektulos Forest docks to have one to wear as well.
UPDATE: Tora recently began to reward folks who go back to visit her after completing the shawl with 5 house item "Coldain Summoning Crystal", so make sure to stop over and have a chat with her if you have not obtained yours yet!
You will need the following items for the various combines listed on this page:
If you are a tinkerer, and make your own gnomish pirate spirits, then you will need the following additional components:
- 1 Crystalline Spiderling Silk (from Capruas pet spider Kltlk)
- 2 Siren Hair (obtained during the quest from Mira) - if you lose a hair for any reason, you can buy another from the Shady Swashbuckler on the Nektulos Forest Docks. (Cost 10p 20g)
- 1 Fresh Clay (Tupta Daily Mission)
- 1 Molkor Hide (Dens in Great Divide)
- 2 Manticore Manes (Dens in Great Divide)
- 1 Iceclad Swordfish (Fished in Great Divide)
- 3 Iceclad Cutlassfish (Fished in Great Divide)
- 1 Genuine Velium Powder (5p,83g,20s from Merchant Hagus in Thurgadin)
- 1 Woven Frost Giant Beard (2p,18g,79s from Merchant Hagus in Thurgadin)
- 2 Gnomish Pirate Spirits (Tinkerer-made)
- 1 Brellium Ore
- 1 Ethereal Material
- 2 Titanium Ore
- 2 Sumac Lumber
- 1 Aerated Mineral Water
- 12 Ethereal Filament
- 7 Ethereal Coal
- 10 Ethereal Sandpaper
- 5 Ethereal Candle
- 5 Ethereal Kindling
- 5 Ethereal Incense
- 2 Titanium Ore
- 2 Frostbitten Parsnip
- 2 Aerated Mineral Water
- 2 Ethereal Coal
Created: 2011-02-24 12:09:48
Last Modified By: Niami Denmother
Last Modified on: 2013-03-28 09:19:10
© 2003-21 Niami Denmother.
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